Website critique please

#11

Quote:

Many people are either on dial-up..
70% of the Dutch people have Broadband or Cable Internet

I don't see how this is relevant to alt.html.critique. This group is not
in the nl.* hierarchy. It is a world wide group.
It's just an example.

I assumed you knew that The Netherlands is way behind in internet
connectivity within Europe.
So that if even 70% of the Dutch have a fast internet connection...
For example: 30% of the people in Norway have 10Mbit+ connections at home.

So sorry if you didn't knew that.
That's why it's revelant.

Please next time you say "Many people are.." or "Many people use.." or
"Many people do..", please base it on facts, statistics or what ever. Now
"many people" seems to be like "me and my family" when you say it.
The same as you say some things are common knowlage, while others even say
you're wrong (em vs. % vs. px).

Wouter

#12

Barbara de Zoete wrote:

Quote:

On Sat, 29 Jan 2005 11:48:56 +0100, Bernhard Sturm
yes, and as ordinary visitors usually have left their UAs wiht their
default settings they would have noticed the 'enter' sign...

It is not at all unusual to switch off the auto-load of images. Many
people are either on dial-up and don't want to wait ages for a page to
load because of a large image, or still pay per amount of data-transfer
and don't want unnecessary, large images to load.

I don't know what your experiences are, but I would assume that the most
common users, hence the targeted audiance, visiting the site in question
are browsing with the UAs default settings (I would like to see some
stats about this, but couldn't find anything on the web...). If you are
going to review a site you should be aware of the fact, that you might
have missed something because you don't have the standards settings on
your UA. If you are in the webdesign business you should not assume that
your personalised UA settings count for anybody else as well. Otherwise
you end up with (most probably) false accusations against the OP.

--
www.daszeichen.ch
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#13

On Sat, 29 Jan 2005 12:26:44 +0100, "Wouter" <no.spam (AT) no (DOT) mail.for.me>
wrote:

Quote:

Many people are either on dial-up..
70% of the Dutch people have Broadband or Cable Internet

I don't see how this is relevant to alt.html.critique. This group is not
in the nl.* hierarchy. It is a world wide group.
It's just an example.

I assumed you knew that The Netherlands is way behind in internet
connectivity within Europe.

Do you have any evidence to back that up? It's not an area I follow in
detail, but according to an article I read about a year ago, the
Netherlands had the *highest* percentage of broadband connections in
Europe. I would be astonished if it is not in the top 10 worldwide (out
of approx. 200 countries).

And incidentally I frequently disable images temporarily over my
broadband connection. Many pages load much faster, and I can always
switch them back on when necessary.

--
Stephen Poley

http://www.xs4all.nl/~sbpoley/webmatters/

#14

Stephen Poley wrote:

Quote:

On Sat, 29 Jan 2005 12:26:44 +0100, "Wouter" <no.spam (AT) no (DOT) mail.for.me
wrote:

Many people are either on dial-up..

70% of the Dutch people have Broadband or Cable Internet

I don't see how this is relevant to alt.html.critique. This group is not
in the nl.* hierarchy. It is a world wide group.

It's just an example.

I assumed you knew that The Netherlands is way behind in internet
connectivity within Europe.

Do you have any evidence to back that up?

check this resources for more info (stats from 16.12.04):

http://www.point-topic.com/content/d...s%20041215.htm

the netherlands are in fact behind the UK, Germany, France and Italy in
the use of broadband lines...

It's not an area I follow in

Quote:

detail, but according to an article I read about a year ago, the
Netherlands had the *highest* percentage of broadband connections in
Europe.

it depends at what you are looking. In absolute numbers the netherlands
are not under the top 10 (but Germany is, for instance). If you are
looking at the penetration of broadband (lines per 100 population) then
they are ranked 4th (behind south korea, hong kong and denmark).

HTH
bernhard

--
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#15

On Sat, 29 Jan 2005 13:30:53 +0100, Bernhard Sturm <sturmnixspam (AT) datacomm (DOT) ch>
wrote:

Quote:

Barbara de Zoete wrote:
On Sat, 29 Jan 2005 11:48:56 +0100, Bernhard Sturm
yes, and as ordinary visitors usually have left their UAs wiht their
default settings they would have noticed the 'enter' sign...

It is not at all unusual to switch off the auto-load of images. Many people
are either on dial-up and don't want to wait ages for a page to load
because of a large image, or still pay per amount of data-transfer and don't
want unnecessary, large images to load.

If you are in the webdesign business you should not assume that your
personalised UA settings count for anybody else as well. Otherwise you end up
with (most probably) false accusations against the OP.

How true. This is visa versa of course. Not just 'not standard' -->
'standard'[1]. Any webdesigner not aware of the infinite possibilities a page
can and _will_ be transferred and communicated to the audience, well ... go find
another hobby/job.
The page in questions doesn't have any signs of this awareness.

[1] As far as this even exists

--
,-- --<--@ -- PretLetters: 'woest wyf', met vele interesses: ----------.

Quote:

#16

On Sat, 29 Jan 2005 12:26:44 +0100, Wouter <no.spam (AT) no (DOT) mail.for.me> wrote:

Quote:

Many people are either on dial-up..
70% of the Dutch people have Broadband or Cable Internet

I don't see how this is relevant to alt.html.critique. This group is not
in the nl.* hierarchy. It is a world wide group.
It's just an example.
I assumed you knew that The Netherlands is way behind in internet
connectivity within Europe.

AFAIK you're the one that is not well informed. I remember reading (newspaper
article, so no url) that the Netherlands is very far ahead in Europe for
example. This is only logical, due to the population density, hence ease of
implementing cable connection.

Please provide evidence of your statement.

Quote:

The same as you say some things are common knowlage, while others even say
you're wrong (em vs. % vs. px).

I'm sorry you didn't understand that em vs px argument. You really seem at loss
here. And you seem to make all in a personal argument as well. I will keep you
in a filter for a while. Find yourselve another 'victim'.

--
,-- --<--@ -- PretLetters: 'woest wyf', met vele interesses: ----------.

Quote:

#17

On Sat, 29 Jan 2005 13:55:37 +0100, Bernhard Sturm <sturmnixspam (AT) datacomm (DOT) ch>
wrote:

Quote:

Stephen Poley wrote:
It's not an area I follow in
detail, but according to an article I read about a year ago, the
Netherlands had the *highest* percentage of broadband connections in
Europe.

it depends at what you are looking. In absolute numbers the netherlands are
not under the top 10 (but Germany is, for instance).

Duh. What use are absolute numbers? If _all_ household of Luxembourgh or Monaco
are on broadband or cable, are they ahead or behind?

Quote:

If you are looking at
the penetration of broadband (lines per 100 population) then they are ranked
4th (behind south korea, hong kong and denmark).

See, that is why the Netherlands as area is useless for comparison with 'world
wide'.

--
,-- --<--@ -- PretLetters: 'woest wyf', met vele interesses: ----------.

Quote:

#18

Bernhard Sturm <sturmnixspam (AT) datacomm (DOT) ch> wrote:

Quote:

I don't know what your experiences are, but I would assume that the most
common users, hence the targeted audiance, visiting the site in question
are browsing with the UAs default settings (I would like to see some
stats about this, but couldn't find anything on the web...). If you are
going to review a site you should be aware of the fact, that you might
have missed something because you don't have the standards settings on
your UA. If you are in the webdesign business you should not assume that
your personalised UA settings count for anybody else as well. Otherwise
you end up with (most probably) false accusations against the OP.

A fundamental rule of quality web coding is that a web site needs to
work for all visitors. This means that you cannot rely on anything being
enabled on the client system except html rendering and text. Anyone who
has a basic understanding of web design can code sites that can work for
all clients, how many people actually have feature x disabled in their
UA is irrelevant.

Btw, I also have images disabled.

--
Spartanicus

#19

Spartanicus wrote:

Quote:

A fundamental rule of quality web coding is that a web site needs to
work for all visitors. This means that you cannot rely on anything being
enabled on the client system except html rendering and text.

A fundamental unfortunately forgotten by the FP generation :-/

--
Ben M.

#20

Barbara de Zoete wrote:

Quote:

On Sat, 29 Jan 2005 13:55:37 +0100, Bernhard Sturm
sturmnixspam (AT) datacomm (DOT) ch> wrote:

Stephen Poley wrote:

It's not an area I follow in
detail, but according to an article I read about a year ago, the
Netherlands had the *highest* percentage of broadband connections in
Europe.

it depends at what you are looking. In absolute numbers the
netherlands are not under the top 10 (but Germany is, for instance).

Duh. What use are absolute numbers?
maybe indicating the sheer of a market? absolute numbers can be very

interesting for investors as they need mass. But you are right, it
doesn't help you by giving you a distribution value. But I never stated
anything else. Stephen Poley asked for the stats, I provided them. It's
up to you to interpret them.

Quote:

If you are looking at
the penetration of broadband (lines per 100 population) then they are
ranked 4th (behind south korea, hong kong and denmark).

See, that is why the Netherlands as area is useless for comparison with
'world wide'.
LOL check the graph again: This is not per area, but per 100 people :-)

so it gives you a good comparable figure about the DSL distribution.

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