Requesting criticisim: www.helpforce.com & www.wc3.co.uk

Hi all,

I was hoping some peeps could find a few spare minutes of the day to check
out a couple of web sites I design, build and administer:

www.helpforce.com - A site providing free technical support through various
methods
and
www.wc3.co.uk - My personal home page. (The /avce section, my portfolio is
due for an update to fit it into the rest of the site soon)


Any comments, queries, questions, suggestions, criticisim of the code, the
graphics, the layout, anything at all is much appreciated!! :-) Feel free to
test any of the forms/scripts if you wish, just say that they are tests.
If you want to know a bit more about me or my work, my site says it best,
but I'm an Undergraduate Lighting Designer in the UK.
Thanks in advance!!

Regards,
-Lawrence Stromski.

In message <c1ihr2$gd1$1 (AT) titan (DOT) btinternet.com>, Lawrence Stromski
<a@b.com> writes

Hi all,

I was hoping some peeps could find a few spare minutes of the day to check
out a couple of web sites I design, build and administer:

www.helpforce.com - A site providing free technical support through various
methods
and
www.wc3.co.uk - My personal home page. (The /avce section, my portfolio is
due for an update to fit it into the rest of the site soon)


Any comments, queries, questions, suggestions, criticisim of the code, the
graphics, the layout, anything at all is much appreciated!! :-) Feel free to
test any of the forms/scripts if you wish, just say that they are tests.
If you want to know a bit more about me or my work, my site says it best,
but I'm an Undergraduate Lighting Designer in the UK.
Thanks in advance!!

Regards,
-Lawrence Stromski.


Initial thoughts:

(a) Ensure *all** you <img> tags have got a suitable 'ALT=' entry

(b) Ensure that the visually-styled headings are appropriately marked-up
in the HTML ..... i.e. use <h1> <h2> <h3> etc.

(c) If you were listening to a site, what would you make of this:

Start of form 1
Text
Not Pressed The Web Pressed This Site
End of form 1.

(d) A question. With reference to your home page on www.helpforce.com ,
in what sequence do you want people to access the information on that
page?


regards.
--
Jake

Tks for your feedback jake.

With regards to point 3, i'm not sure what you mean by that. How does that
relate to my site and which one?

Point 4: There is no sequence for information on that site. Imagine you are
coming to helpforce.com to get help with a problem, it's just layed out
hopefully so that people can find the best way of getting help with their
problem, maybe they'd go to the FAQ if they think it's a popular problem,
they might go to the forum if they want to have a discussion, the majority
of people just robot-like fill out the ehelp form.


Thanks!

-Lawrence Stromski.




"jake" <jake (AT) gododdin (DOT) demon.co.uk> wrote

In message <c1ihr2$gd1$1 (AT) titan (DOT) btinternet.com>, Lawrence Stromski
a@b.com> writes
Hi all,

I was hoping some peeps could find a few spare minutes of the day to
check
out a couple of web sites I design, build and administer:

www.helpforce.com - A site providing free technical support through
various
methods
and
www.wc3.co.uk - My personal home page. (The /avce section, my portfolio
is
due for an update to fit it into the rest of the site soon)


Any comments, queries, questions, suggestions, criticisim of the code,
the
graphics, the layout, anything at all is much appreciated!! :-) Feel free
to
test any of the forms/scripts if you wish, just say that they are tests.
If you want to know a bit more about me or my work, my site says it best,
but I'm an Undergraduate Lighting Designer in the UK.
Thanks in advance!!

Regards,
-Lawrence Stromski.


Initial thoughts:

(a) Ensure *all** you <img> tags have got a suitable 'ALT=' entry

(b) Ensure that the visually-styled headings are appropriately marked-up
in the HTML ..... i.e. use <h1> <h2> <h3> etc.

(c) If you were listening to a site, what would you make of this:

Start of form 1
Text
Not Pressed The Web Pressed This Site
End of form 1.

(d) A question. With reference to your home page on www.helpforce.com ,
in what sequence do you want people to access the information on that
page?


regards.
--
Jake

In message <c1nfbq$p9v$1 (AT) sparta (DOT) btinternet.com>, Lawrence Stromski
<a@b.com> writes

Tks for your feedback jake.

With regards to point 3, i'm not sure what you mean by that. How does that
relate to my site and which one?

OK.

A user of a non-visual reader/browser visiting your site
(http://www.wc3.co.uk/) will hear:

http://www.gododdin.demon.co.uk/ng/wc3.htm

In particular, they'll come to the part where they hear:
----------------------------------------------------------
Start of form 1.
Text.
Not Pressed. The Web Pressed. This Site
End of form 1.
images/searchbutt.png: Image Button.
----------------------------------------------------------

A user of a visual browser will know that it's a search engine from the
layout, Google logo, etc., but it's not so clear to the non-visual user
as to what this is.

Hence the need for correct alternative text on the images.

[snip]

--
Jake

In message <c1nfbq$p9v$1 (AT) sparta (DOT) btinternet.com>, Lawrence Stromski
<a@b.com> writes

Tks for your feedback jake.
[snip]

Point 4: There is no sequence for information on that site. Imagine you are
coming to helpforce.com to get help with a problem, it's just layed out
hopefully so that people can find the best way of getting help with their
problem, maybe they'd go to the FAQ if they think it's a popular problem,
they might go to the forum if they want to have a discussion, the majority
of people just robot-like fill out the ehelp form.


OK. This is what a user of assistive technology

(screen-reader/voice-browser) is going to hear when they visit your
(homeforce) site.

As it's a tables-based layout, the reader is going to linearize and read
the text in the following sequence:

http://www.gododdin.demon.co.uk/ng/helpforce.txt

Now. Does it all make sense in that sequence?

Hopefully, if you start putting in the correct alternative text on the
images and (very importantly) start putting in headers the visitor will
have a more rewarding experience.

On a site like this, headers are going to be invaluable if the user is
going to find their way around.

Also, consider whether things like "Visit by clicking on eTalk on the
left. " are do-able if I can't see what you're talking about ;-)

[snip]

Regards.

--
Jake

Ok, thanks for clarifying that Jake. I see what you mean now

Helpforce.com:
************
I take your point completely, for people using text browsers for whatever
reason (dissability or not) perhaps the site should be more accessible. I
shall give it some thought. Perhaps a text-only site like BBC News and
others offer would be in order. This would be good for WAP/PDA and
small-screen users too.



Wc3.co.uk:
**********
I am a lighting designer, I work in the visual and graphic arts and
practices.

You could say that there isn't much point in people with sight difficulties
going to art galleries, as there isn't much point in them viewing lighting
and special effects so my site isn't particularly targeted to people of that
nature. Please please understand (because I can see the flames before
they're written) I'm not being prejudice, thats just the way it is.

As for people with text browsers who don't have a visual dissability, my
site isn't targeted to them either, for the same reason, I work and practice
visual arts. If they are intrested, they need to look at my site with a
graphical browser, if they arn't, chances are they don't have an intrest in
graphics anyway so they won't so thats cool.
Maybe for these I shall insert a text-browser detection script informing
them that my site isn't viewable without a graphical browser. Food for
thought.



Thanks
-Lawrence.




"jake" <jake (AT) gododdin (DOT) demon.co.uk> wrote

In message <c1nfbq$p9v$1 (AT) sparta (DOT) btinternet.com>, Lawrence Stromski
a@b.com> writes
Tks for your feedback jake.

With regards to point 3, i'm not sure what you mean by that. How does
that
relate to my site and which one?

OK.

A user of a non-visual reader/browser visiting your site
(http://www.wc3.co.uk/) will hear:

http://www.gododdin.demon.co.uk/ng/wc3.htm

In particular, they'll come to the part where they hear:
----------------------------------------------------------
Start of form 1.
Text.
Not Pressed. The Web Pressed. This Site
End of form 1.
images/searchbutt.png: Image Button.
----------------------------------------------------------

A user of a visual browser will know that it's a search engine from the
layout, Google logo, etc., but it's not so clear to the non-visual user
as to what this is.

Hence the need for correct alternative text on the images.


[snip]

--
Jake

On Fri, 27 Feb 2004 21:57:53 +0000 (UTC), Lawrence Stromski <a@b.com>
wrote:

You could say that there isn't much point in people with sight
difficulties
going to art galleries, as there isn't much point in them viewing
lighting
and special effects so my site isn't particularly targeted to people of
that
nature. Please please understand (because I can see the flames before
they're written) I'm not being prejudice, thats just the way it is.

As for people with text browsers who don't have a visual dissability, my
site isn't targeted to them either, for the same reason, I work and
practice
visual arts. If they are intrested, they need to look at my site with a
graphical browser, if they arn't, chances are they don't have an intrest
in
graphics anyway so they won't so thats cool.
Maybe for these I shall insert a text-browser detection script informing
them that my site isn't viewable without a graphical browser. Food for
thought.

The old story of a blind person searching for information on behalf of
others comes to mind. It's unsafe to assume that deaf people have no use
for music, or that sightless people have no use for images, or that people
with no hands will never purchase a pair of gloves.

BTW, load time for me was 2:38.

Bryan Anderson <usenet (AT) anderson-it (DOT) com> wrote in
news:5dru30ptl01g6cl7d3b889nov3p6mcgtg8 (AT) 4ax (DOT) com:

On Friday, Lawrence Stromski wrote:

With regards to point 3, i'm not sure what you mean by that.
How does that relate to my site and which one?

Don't know which site it was or what page, but it's what would
be 'read out' by a text-to-speech conversion process, used by
blind and partially sighted people.

And by the robots that do the indexing for search engines. AKA "your most
important users."

Lawrence Stromski wrote:

Wc3.co.uk

On many of the pages you include:

<script type="text/javascript">
<!--
function openWindow(url, name, w, h) // Pop-up window function
{
popupWin = window.open(url, name, 'scrollbars,width=' + w + ',height='
+ h);
}
</script>

Apart from the fact that pop-up windows are irritating, you forgot to
include the "-->" at the end of your comment, so some browsers assume
that the entire rest of the page is a comment, to be ignored.

Besides which, if you move the script so that it's within the
<head>...</head> you won't need to use the commenting out trick at all.

--
Toby A Inkster BSc (Hons) ARCS
Contact Me - http://www.goddamn.co.uk/tobyink/?page=132

Search engine listings are fine Eric, the "good" search engines all get text
from my meta tags, from the first line of the web site (look carefully,
there is an obscured first line with a description of both sites).




"Eric Bohlman" <ebohlman (AT) earthlink (DOT) net> wrote

Bryan Anderson <usenet (AT) anderson-it (DOT) com> wrote in
news:5dru30ptl01g6cl7d3b889nov3p6mcgtg8 (AT) 4ax (DOT) com:

On Friday, Lawrence Stromski wrote:

With regards to point 3, i'm not sure what you mean by that.
How does that relate to my site and which one?

Don't know which site it was or what page, but it's what would
be 'read out' by a text-to-speech conversion process, used by
blind and partially sighted people.

And by the robots that do the indexing for search engines. AKA "your most
important users."