Manipulating Google results -how so quick?

Makes interesting reading this recent Google talk!

The thing I'm wondering about is normally Google does it's scheduled dance
(update) then eventually everything settles in it's true position. But when
I hear of Sam and Dave (replacement for Chaz and Dave?) talk of their sites
dropping but then doing some tweaking and suddenly their sites are back up,
ranking high again, I wonder how is this so quickly achievable? If the
listings are so dynamic and easily manipulated then the updates don't matter
in terms of settling into a position? What's the key behind making these
changes update a ranking so fast? Is it the fact that at least one high PR
site is involved i.e. frequently visited by the Googlebot, that allows for
these quick updates?

Thanks.

David (Perplexed)


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.547 / Virus Database: 340 - Release Date: 02/12/2003

David wrote:

Makes interesting reading this recent Google talk!

The thing I'm wondering about is normally Google does it's scheduled dance
(update) then eventually everything settles in it's true position. But when
I hear of Sam and Dave (replacement for Chaz and Dave?) talk of their sites
dropping but then doing some tweaking and suddenly their sites are back up,
ranking high again, I wonder how is this so quickly achievable? If the
listings are so dynamic and easily manipulated then the updates don't matter
in terms of settling into a position? What's the key behind making these
changes update a ranking so fast? Is it the fact that at least one high PR
site is involved i.e. frequently visited by the Googlebot, that allows for
these quick updates?

Thanks.

David (Perplexed)

---
You've hit it on the head. The changes happen fast because my pr is high

(pr6) and so more google visits to my site. I have some pr5 sites that
were only visited a few times in the last few weeks but my pr6 sites get
visited within a day or two once I make a change. I can only imagine
what a pr7 must be like let alone a pr10.
When my sites had low pr like 0-3 it took months. You'd try something
new and by the time it updated you had forgotten all about it, very
frustrating working with low pr sites.

You can manipulate your serps if your site is the strongest or one of
the strongest ones there. There have been many a time when I created
what seemed like a regular google dance to happen to the top 3 or 4
pages of my serp just by changing something that effected my position
and also effected all the other sites there as well.

The one thing I still find slower in google visits at my pr6 sites are
my internal pages. They're all pr6 as well but for some reason google
doesn't visit them as often. What's a bummer is I have about 4
experimental pages going on and they still haven't been updated yet so I
can't find out the results from those. Hopefully when I get my sites to
pr7 that will speed those up.

Back links (incoming) also get updated a little faster as well with my
pr6 sites but still take anywhere from 2-4 weeks. I've heard with a pr7
site it only take a few days to a week to get those.

On Mon, 8 Dec 2003 13:38:54 -0000, "David"
<david (AT) dontspammyemailyoubuggers (DOT) com> wrote:

Makes interesting reading this recent Google talk!

The thing I'm wondering about is normally Google does it's scheduled dance
(update) then eventually everything settles in it's true position. But when
I hear of Sam and Dave (replacement for Chaz and Dave?) talk of their sites
dropping but then doing some tweaking and suddenly their sites are back up,
ranking high again, I wonder how is this so quickly achievable?

Hi,

Not enough time to respond fully, but my site never dropped. for the
Lingerie SERP it went up a bit then back down, so no miraculous
recovery. My SERP is where it was before the 16th.

Here's my Lingerie SERP results

Dec 8, 2003 12
Dec 6, 2003 10
Dec 5, 2003 10
Dec 4, 2003 10
Dec 2, 2003 10
Dec 1, 2003 10
Nov 30, 2003 10
Nov 29, 2003 8
Nov 27, 2003 10
Nov 26, 2003 6
Nov 24, 2003 6
Nov 23, 2003 6
Nov 22, 2003 6
Nov 21, 2003 6
Nov 20, 2003 12
Nov 19, 2003 11
Nov 17, 2003 11
Nov 16, 2003 12
Nov 15, 2003 12
Nov 13, 2003 12
Nov 12, 2003 12
Nov 11, 2003 12
Nov 10, 2003 12
Nov 9, 2003 12
Nov 8, 2003 12
Nov 7, 2003 12
Nov 6, 2003 17
Nov 5, 2003 16
Nov 3, 2003 16
Nov 2, 2003 15
Nov 1, 2003 15
Oct 30, 2003 16
Oct 28, 2003 16
Oct 27, 2003 15
Oct 26, 2003 15
Oct 24, 2003 15
Oct 23, 2003 16
Oct 22, 2003 17
Oct 20, 2003 13
Oct 19, 2003 13
Oct 18, 2003 13
Oct 17, 2003 13
Oct 16, 2003 13
Oct 15, 2003 13
Oct 14, 2003 13
Oct 13, 2003 13
Oct 12, 2003 13
Oct 11, 2003 13

Also I have done no tweaking, I've made one large planned update
(around the 16th by coincidence) and will be doing another soon if I
ever stop reading and posting here (I seem to be addicted!!). I have
made no major changes to the way I do SEO this month.

Sam's SERP did drop from existence and after making some major changes
has got back to 6th. He'll deny it, but the changes are based on the
advice I gave him by email (over 90+ emails to date) starting on the
16th! This is for a easy SERP that gives hardly any traffic, he also
has a pretty large resource in terms of PR and domains (multiple PR6s)
so should be 1st in this SERP and with the changes he's made (not
everything I advised) he should keep in the top 10, probably top 3
soon.

If the
listings are so dynamic and easily manipulated then the updates don't matter
in terms of settling into a position? What's the key behind making these
changes update a ranking so fast? Is it the fact that at least one high PR
site is involved i.e. frequently visited by the Googlebot, that allows for
these quick updates?

So the SERPs aren't easy to manipulate, it takes time.

David
_
Free Search Engine Optimization, SEO and
Search Engine Placement Tips (updated 16/11/2003)
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/ooar123...-optimization/
Free SEO Mailing List
http://www.freelists.org/cgi-bin/list?list_id=3290

Thanks.

David (Perplexed)


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.547 / Virus Database: 340 - Release Date: 02/12/2003

Makes interesting reading this recent Google talk!

The thing I'm wondering about is normally Google does it's scheduled
dance
(update) then eventually everything settles in it's true position. But
when
I hear of Sam and Dave (replacement for Chaz and Dave?) talk of their
sites
dropping but then doing some tweaking and suddenly their sites are back
up,
ranking high again, I wonder how is this so quickly achievable?

Hi,

Not enough time to respond fully, but my site never dropped. for the
Lingerie SERP it went up a bit then back down, so no miraculous
recovery. My SERP is where it was before the 16th.

snip

Sam's SERP did drop from existence and after making some major changes

has got back to 6th. He'll deny it, but the changes are based on the
advice I gave him by email (over 90+ emails to date) starting on the
16th! This is for a easy SERP that gives hardly any traffic, he also
has a pretty large resource in terms of PR and domains (multiple PR6s)
so should be 1st in this SERP and with the changes he's made (not
everything I advised) he should keep in the top 10, probably top 3
soon.

Thanks for all the info guys. You two are definitely a force to be reckoned
with, maybe you should get together on a joint "adult" related project! The
only thing that bothers me is that Google staff must watch this newsgroup
and your activities, and it only takes an unethical SEO practice report to
google to put a spanner in the works, which also may have implications for
anyone following your advice. Just a small concern! How do you sleep at
night? Then again, the bigger the risks you take the better the rewards. I'm
just a chicken really. Thanks again guys.

David


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.547 / Virus Database: 340 - Release Date: 02/12/2003

SEO Dave wrote:

Sam's SERP did drop from existence and after making some major changes
has got back to 6th. He'll deny it, but the changes are based on the
advice I gave him by email (over 90+ emails to date) starting on the
16th! This is for a easy SERP that gives hardly any traffic, he also
has a pretty large resource in terms of PR and domains (multiple PR6s)
so should be 1st in this SERP and with the changes he's made (not
everything I advised) he should keep in the top 10, probably top 3
soon.

The changes are in a way based on what you told me in that you got me

thinking about different ways of re-doing my sites but the actual
changes you made for me on that one site didn't click so I had to change
them and come up with something along the same principles but different
in my own style of seo. The one thing I find with seo is everyone has a
slightly different way of doing it and you have to go with what feels
right to you even though it may or may not work for someone else's site.
The biggest change isn't on the site on page one but the one on page 4
that came back from nowhere. For that I based it a lot on the faq site.
I may still be off with that site because it really should also be on
page one too right now. Still have to run more experiemts similiar to it
at other sites I have and should know within the next few weeks.

So the SERPs aren't easy to manipulate, it takes time.

David

It depends really, most of the times it's slow esp when links are

involved but if it's things like text and header changes and your site
has high pr the change can happen very quickly in a few days.