define rollover links

#1

According to La Whalen this week some rollover links are followable by
engines. They are? Frankly I can't work out what she's on about. Any
ideas?

BB

#2

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 04:28:54 GMT, Big Bill <kruse (AT) cityscape (DOT) co.uk>
wrote:

Quote:

According to La Whalen this week some rollover links are followable by
engines. They are? Frankly I can't work out what she's on about. Any
ideas?

BB

All true.

If the rollovers are the type you get with Dreamweaver and Frontpage
sites that change the image as you hover over them, then they have
always been followed by bots since the rollover bit is ignored by them
leaving a standard link.

For example.

Browsers see-

<a href="http://www.site.co.uk" onMouseOut="MM_swapImgRestore()"
onMouseOver="MM_swapImage('Image1','','menu/home-over.gif',1)"><img
name="Image1" src="invitation-images/invitations.gif" width="120"
height="25" alt="some text"></a>

Google understands it as-
<a href="http://www.site.co.uk"><img name="Image1"
src="invitation-images/invitations.gif" width="120" height="25"
alt="some text"></a>

A standard image link.

if the <a href=" bit is enclose by a script tag then bots will have a
problem-

<script>document.write('<a href="http://www.site.co.uk"><img
name="Image1" src="invitation-images/invitations.gif" width="120"
height="25" alt="some text"></a>');</script>

This is why there was a mention of menu applets since they are
scripts.

David
--
http://www.search-engine-optimization-services.co.uk/

#3

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 18:59:46 GMT, SEO Dave
<seo-daveSP (AT) AMsearch-engine-optimization-services (DOT) co.uk> wrote:

Quote:

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 04:28:54 GMT, Big Bill <kruse (AT) cityscape (DOT) co.uk
wrote:

According to La Whalen this week some rollover links are followable by
engines. They are? Frankly I can't work out what she's on about. Any
ideas?

BB

All true.

If the rollovers are the type you get with Dreamweaver and Frontpage
sites that change the image as you hover over them, then they have
always been followed by bots since the rollover bit is ignored by them
leaving a standard link.

For example.

Browsers see-

a href="http://www.site.co.uk" onMouseOut="MM_swapImgRestore()"
onMouseOver="MM_swapImage('Image1','','menu/home-over.gif',1)"><img
name="Image1" src="invitation-images/invitations.gif" width="120"
height="25" alt="some text"></a

Google understands it as-
a href="http://www.site.co.uk"><img name="Image1"
src="invitation-images/invitations.gif" width="120" height="25"
alt="some text"></a

A standard image link.

Stay with me here. How bout if there's an onclick in there somewhere?
Without the onclick there's no execution, no?

BB

Quote:

if the <a href=" bit is enclose by a script tag then bots will have a
problem-

script>document.write('<a href="http://www.site.co.uk"><img
name="Image1" src="invitation-images/invitations.gif" width="120"
height="25" alt="some text"></a>');</script

This is why there was a mention of menu applets since they are
scripts.

David

#4

Big Bill wrote:

Quote:

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 19:51:07 GMT, Big Bill <kruse (AT) cityscape (DOT) co.uk
wrote:

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 18:59:46 GMT, SEO Dave
seo-daveSP (AT) AMsearch-engine-opti...es (DOT) co.uk> wrote:

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 04:28:54 GMT, Big Bill <kruse (AT) cityscape (DOT) co.uk
wrote:

According to La Whalen this week some rollover links are followable by
engines. They are? Frankly I can't work out what she's on about. Any
ideas?

BB

All true.

If the rollovers are the type you get with Dreamweaver and Frontpage
sites that change the image as you hover over them, then they have
always been followed by bots since the rollover bit is ignored by them
leaving a standard link.

For example.

Browsers see-

a href="http://www.site.co.uk" onMouseOut="MM_swapImgRestore()"
onMouseOver="MM_swapImage('Image1','','menu/home-over.gif',1)"><img
name="Image1" src="invitation-images/invitations.gif" width="120"
height="25" alt="some text"></a

Google understands it as-
a href="http://www.site.co.uk"><img name="Image1"
src="invitation-images/invitations.gif" width="120" height="25"
alt="some text"></a

A standard image link.

Stay with me here. How bout if there's an onclick in there somewhere?
Without the onclick there's no execution, no?

BB

ahem, by which I mean of course without the physical onclick the
engines can't follow the link?
I go by what one can see in a Lynx browser. If the link isn't visible
in that then it ain't a link.

If you're meaning the sort of Javascript link like eg:

<a href="#" onclick="document.location = 'http://www.site.co.uk'">
<a href="#" onclick="call_to_some_function()">

Then it would be fairly safe to assume that bots don't follow those, as the
onclick event handler is some Javascript or a call to a built in or custom
Javascript function. Unless they've coded their bots to parse Javascript
then it seems unlikely they'd be able to follow them.

If the link is like this though:

<a href="http://www.other.co.uk" onclick="document.location =
'http://www.site.co.uk'">

Then the bot should be able to see the http://www.other.co.uk address.

I'd go with assuming that if Lynx can follow the link, a normal bot can
follow the link, and if Lynx can't, the bot can't.

--
Chris Hope - The Electric Toolbox - http://www.electrictoolbox.com/

#5

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 19:51:07 GMT, Big Bill <kruse (AT) cityscape (DOT) co.uk>
wrote:

Quote:

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 18:59:46 GMT, SEO Dave
seo-daveSP (AT) AMsearch-engine-opti...es (DOT) co.uk> wrote:

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 04:28:54 GMT, Big Bill <kruse (AT) cityscape (DOT) co.uk
wrote:

According to La Whalen this week some rollover links are followable by
engines. They are? Frankly I can't work out what she's on about. Any
ideas?

BB

All true.

If the rollovers are the type you get with Dreamweaver and Frontpage
sites that change the image as you hover over them, then they have
always been followed by bots since the rollover bit is ignored by them
leaving a standard link.

For example.

Browsers see-

a href="http://www.site.co.uk" onMouseOut="MM_swapImgRestore()"
onMouseOver="MM_swapImage('Image1','','menu/home-over.gif',1)"><img
name="Image1" src="invitation-images/invitations.gif" width="120"
height="25" alt="some text"></a

Google understands it as-
a href="http://www.site.co.uk"><img name="Image1"
src="invitation-images/invitations.gif" width="120" height="25"
alt="some text"></a

A standard image link.

Stay with me here. How bout if there's an onclick in there somewhere?
Without the onclick there's no execution, no?

BB

ahem, by which I mean of course without the physical onclick the
engines can't follow the link?
I go by what one can see in a Lynx browser. If the link isn't visible
in that then it ain't a link.

BB

#6

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 20:57:13 GMT, Big Bill <kruse (AT) cityscape (DOT) co.uk>
wrote:

Quote:

Stay with me here. How bout if there's an onclick in there somewhere?
Without the onclick there's no execution, no?

BB

ahem, by which I mean of course without the physical onclick the
engines can't follow the link?
I go by what one can see in a Lynx browser. If the link isn't visible
in that then it ain't a link.

BB

Not quite sure what you mean, do you have a code example?

Generally though if it's not viewable in Lynx it's not good for bots.

David
--
http://www.search-engine-optimization-services.co.uk/

#7

On Fri, 13 Aug 2004 08:06:22 +1200, Chris Hope
<blackhole (AT) electrictoolbox (DOT) com> wrote:

Quote:

Big Bill wrote:

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 19:51:07 GMT, Big Bill <kruse (AT) cityscape (DOT) co.uk
wrote:

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 18:59:46 GMT, SEO Dave
seo-daveSP (AT) AMsearch-engine-opti...es (DOT) co.uk> wrote:

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 04:28:54 GMT, Big Bill <kruse (AT) cityscape (DOT) co.uk
wrote:

According to La Whalen this week some rollover links are followable by
engines. They are? Frankly I can't work out what she's on about. Any
ideas?

BB

All true.

If the rollovers are the type you get with Dreamweaver and Frontpage
sites that change the image as you hover over them, then they have
always been followed by bots since the rollover bit is ignored by them
leaving a standard link.

For example.

Browsers see-

a href="http://www.site.co.uk" onMouseOut="MM_swapImgRestore()"
onMouseOver="MM_swapImage('Image1','','menu/home-over.gif',1)"><img
name="Image1" src="invitation-images/invitations.gif" width="120"
height="25" alt="some text"></a

Google understands it as-
a href="http://www.site.co.uk"><img name="Image1"
src="invitation-images/invitations.gif" width="120" height="25"
alt="some text"></a

A standard image link.

Stay with me here. How bout if there's an onclick in there somewhere?
Without the onclick there's no execution, no?

BB

ahem, by which I mean of course without the physical onclick the
engines can't follow the link?
I go by what one can see in a Lynx browser. If the link isn't visible
in that then it ain't a link.

If you're meaning the sort of Javascript link like eg:

a href="#" onclick="document.location = 'http://www.site.co.uk'"
a href="#" onclick="call_to_some_function()"

Then it would be fairly safe to assume that bots don't follow those, as the
onclick event handler is some Javascript or a call to a built in or custom
Javascript function. Unless they've coded their bots to parse Javascript
then it seems unlikely they'd be able to follow them.

If the link is like this though:

a href="http://www.other.co.uk" onclick="document.location =
'http://www.site.co.uk'"

Then the bot should be able to see the http://www.other.co.uk address.

I'd go with assuming that if Lynx can follow the link, a normal bot can
follow the link, and if Lynx can't, the bot can't.

Ya, and when Lynx can't even see that a link is there, I'm guessing it
won't be followed.

BB

#8

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 21:38:53 GMT, SEO Dave
<seo-daveSP (AT) AMsearch-engine-optimization-services (DOT) co.uk> wrote:

Quote:

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 20:57:13 GMT, Big Bill <kruse (AT) cityscape (DOT) co.uk
wrote:

Stay with me here. How bout if there's an onclick in there somewhere?
Without the onclick there's no execution, no?

BB

ahem, by which I mean of course without the physical onclick the
engines can't follow the link?
I go by what one can see in a Lynx browser. If the link isn't visible
in that then it ain't a link.

BB

Not quite sure what you mean, do you have a code example?

Oh look!

<td width="50"><img src="imgs/n6.jpg" width="50" height="21"></td>
<td width="127"><a href="#" onMouseOut="MM_swapImgRestore()"
onMouseOver="MM_swapImage('Image20','','imgs/book_on.gif',1)"
onClick="MM_openBrWindow('bookings.html','','scrol lbars=yes,width=500,height=550')"><img
name="Image20" border="0" src="imgs/book_off.gif" width="127"
height="21"></a></td>

I just happened to have it in my pocket....it's actually to the
bookings.html page although it's bleedin' ard to follow it in all
that.....

BB

Quote:

Generally though if it's not viewable in Lynx it's not good for bots.

David

#9

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 22:16:19 GMT, Big Bill <kruse (AT) cityscape (DOT) co.uk>
wrote:

Quote:

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 21:38:53 GMT, SEO Dave
seo-daveSP (AT) AMsearch-engine-opti...es (DOT) co.uk> wrote:

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 20:57:13 GMT, Big Bill <kruse (AT) cityscape (DOT) co.uk
wrote:

Stay with me here. How bout if there's an onclick in there somewhere?
Without the onclick there's no execution, no?

BB

ahem, by which I mean of course without the physical onclick the
engines can't follow the link?
I go by what one can see in a Lynx browser. If the link isn't visible
in that then it ain't a link.

BB

Not quite sure what you mean, do you have a code example?

Oh look!

td width="50"><img src="imgs/n6.jpg" width="50" height="21"></td
td width="127"><a href="#" onMouseOut="MM_swapImgRestore()"
onMouseOver="MM_swapImage('Image20','','imgs/book_on.gif',1)"
onClick="MM_openBrWindow('bookings.html','','scrol lbars=yes,width=500,height=550')"><img
name="Image20" border="0" src="imgs/book_off.gif" width="127"
height="21"></a></td

With the above Google should read it as-

<td width="50"><img src="imgs/n6.jpg" width="50" height="21"></td>
<td width="127"><a href="#"><img
name="Image20" border="0" src="imgs/book_off.gif" width="127"
height="21"></a></td>

So Google should see it as a link, but not to bookings.html, to #
instead.

Not sure how bots treats a link to #, but guess it will waste the PR.

Quote:

I just happened to have it in my pocket....it's actually to the
bookings.html page although it's bleedin' ard to follow it in all
that.....

This is the link bit when you strip out all the table stuff etc...

<a href="#"><img border="0" src="imgs/book_off.gif" width="127"
height="21"></a>

BTW even if the above type of link is spiderable it's missing alt
text, so little benefit will be transferred to the page it's linking
to.

Quote:

BB

Generally though if it's not viewable in Lynx it's not good for bots.

David

David
--
http://www.search-engine-optimization-services.co.uk/

#10

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 23:57:00 GMT, SEO Dave
<seo-daveSP (AT) AMsearch-engine-optimization-services (DOT) co.uk> wrote:

Quote:

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 22:16:19 GMT, Big Bill <kruse (AT) cityscape (DOT) co.uk
wrote:

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 21:38:53 GMT, SEO Dave
seo-daveSP (AT) AMsearch-engine-opti...es (DOT) co.uk> wrote:

On Thu, 12 Aug 2004 20:57:13 GMT, Big Bill <kruse (AT) cityscape (DOT) co.uk
wrote:

Stay with me here. How bout if there's an onclick in there somewhere?
Without the onclick there's no execution, no?

BB

ahem, by which I mean of course without the physical onclick the
engines can't follow the link?
I go by what one can see in a Lynx browser. If the link isn't visible
in that then it ain't a link.

BB

Not quite sure what you mean, do you have a code example?

Oh look!

td width="50"><img src="imgs/n6.jpg" width="50" height="21"></td
td width="127"><a href="#" onMouseOut="MM_swapImgRestore()"
onMouseOver="MM_swapImage('Image20','','imgs/book_on.gif',1)"
onClick="MM_openBrWindow('bookings.html','','scrol lbars=yes,width=500,height=550')"><img
name="Image20" border="0" src="imgs/book_off.gif" width="127"
height="21"></a></td

With the above Google should read it as-

td width="50"><img src="imgs/n6.jpg" width="50" height="21"></td
td width="127"><a href="#"><img
name="Image20" border="0" src="imgs/book_off.gif" width="127"
height="21"></a></td

So Google should see it as a link, but not to bookings.html, to #
instead.

Not sure how bots treats a link to #, but guess it will waste the PR.

I just happened to have it in my pocket....it's actually to the
bookings.html page although it's bleedin' ard to follow it in all
that.....

This is the link bit when you strip out all the table stuff etc...

a href="#"><img border="0" src="imgs/book_off.gif" width="127"
height="21"></a

BTW even if the above type of link is spiderable it's missing alt
text, so little benefit will be transferred to the page it's linking
to.

I knew that about the alt test. I don't altogether agree with
everything you've said though (unusual, eh?) because the link actually
works and gets to bookings.html. That file has "#" in it but only in
reference to colours ("#blah-de-blah"). Quite how a browser knows to
get to bookings.html from that lot...any scripters among us?

BB

Quote:

BB

Generally though if it's not viewable in Lynx it's not good for bots.

David

David