W3C and Accesibility Validation Help, Please

On Mon 12 Jul 2004 07:47:25p, Lane Baldwin wrote in
macromedia.dreamweaver:

Meaning I'm going to need to learn more about CSS....which I knew was
in my future. <smile> Would you happen to know if this is something I
can do in DW4, or will I need a separate CSS editor?

I use TopStyle Lite (http://www.bradsoft.com/topstyle/), a free version of
which ships with DW (or at least with the suite). If it's not on your CD,
you can d/l from the site - I hadn't realized, but it's up to v 3.1.

"Joe Makowiec" <webmaster (AT) munged (DOT) brunswicklibrary.invalid> wrote

I use TopStyle Lite (http://www.bradsoft.com/topstyle/), a free version of
which ships with DW (or at least with the suite). If it's not on your CD,
you can d/l from the site - I hadn't realized, but it's up to v 3.1.

Thanks, Joe. Headed there now.

Lane

"darrel" <notreal (AT) hotmail (DOT) com> wrote

I've had W3C AAA pages fail with Bobby and vice versa.

Realize that markup validation and accessibility validation can be
mutually
exclusive. Good, well formed markup usually makes the page easier to make
accessible, but it isn't necessarily a direct correlation.

-Darrel

So what is the difference between W3C wcag aaa and Bobby aaa; or more to the
point, why is there a difference?

Terry

<snip>
US Mornin' Dude
UK Good afternoon Old Chap.

BOBBY 508
A lot of ifs

If you can't make a page accessible, construct an alternate accessible
version.

N/A

If style sheets are ignored or unsupported, are pages still readable and
usable?

I can read it

If this is a data table (not used for layout only), identify headers for
the table rows
and columns. (1 instance) Line 12

Not a data table so N/A

If you use color to convey information, make sure the information is also
represented
another way. (10 instances) Lines 16, 17, 25, 32, 42, 43, 51, 56, 64, 68

I think Darrel gave the solution to this but I will stick my neck out here.
You are not actually saying "click on the green button to continue" so, if
you use css for formatting,
it should remove the problem and Bobby should be OK with it. (too many
shoulds)

If an image conveys important information beyond what is in its alternative
text,
provide an extended description. (6 instances) Lines 16, 25, 51, 56, 64, 68

Some of the above are not even images.

If a table has two or more rows or columns that serve as headers, use
structural
markup to identify their hierarchy and relationship. (1 instance) Line 12

N/A

Please note that N/A is short for "not applicable in my very humble
opinion".

This should validate for Section 508 which should be OK for now. Next
step - WAI WCAG AAA

If you want to hang on for a day or two I can send you my interpretation of
the page, using css, for you have a look at.
( then we get the experts to add the finishing touches)

Off to see the Osteopath now. Pay a guy £50 an hour to beat me up.

CUL

Terry

LANE!

You've got to be kidding. Small world! Remember me?



"Lane Baldwin" <lane (AT) NOlanebaldwinSPAM (DOT) com> wrote

I just ran one of my websites (www.laneonbass.com) through
http://validator.w3.org/ and got two errors:

-----------------

1. Line 1, column 61: invalid formal public identifier "-//w3c//dtd html
4.01 transitional//en": invalid public text class

...type html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.01 transitional//en"


2. Line 10, column 37: there is no attribute "HEIGHT"

table width="775" border="0" height="435" cellspacing="10"
align="center"

You have used the attribute named above in your document, but the document
type you are using does not support that attribute for this element. This
error is often caused by incorrect use of the "Strict" document type with
a
document that uses frames (e.g. you must use the "Transitional" document
type to get the "target" attribute), or by using vendor proprietary
extensions such as "marginheight" (this is usually fixed by using CSS to
achieve the desired effect instead).

This error may also result if the element itself is not supported in the
document type you are using, as an undefined element will have no
supported
attributes; in this case, see the element-undefined error message for
further information.

How to fix: check the spelling and case of the element and attribute,
(Remember XHTML is all lower-case) and/or check that they are both allowed
in the chosen document type, and/or use CSS instead of this attribute.

------------------------

So...my first question is :What type of document is this? I am *not* a
hand
coder to any extent, and honestly don't know how to tell what type of
document this is. Is there an explanation that even non-technical types
can
understand?

Second question: How do I solve error two? If I get the doc type correct,
will it go away on its own?

As for accesibility issues, isn't there a site that validates
accessibility
of pages? Or would someone here care to offer their feedback?

As always, many thanks to everyone for the assistance and feedback.

Lane

Thanks, Terry! I feel a bit better now, knowing that you can read the page
all right. I'm going to work on learning more CSS over the next several
days. Of course, that won't be the end of it...I've got a (lot( to learn!
<smile>

Am more than willing to wait a few days...and would really appreciate your
input. Good luck with the Osteopath!

Lane

"webmaster" <terryuse (AT) btopenworld (DOT) com> wrote

snip
US Mornin' Dude
UK Good afternoon Old Chap.

BOBBY 508
A lot of ifs

If you can't make a page accessible, construct an alternate accessible
version.

N/A

If style sheets are ignored or unsupported, are pages still readable and
usable?

I can read it

If this is a data table (not used for layout only), identify headers for
the table rows
and columns. (1 instance) Line 12

Not a data table so N/A

If you use color to convey information, make sure the information is also
represented
another way. (10 instances) Lines 16, 17, 25, 32, 42, 43, 51, 56, 64, 68

I think Darrel gave the solution to this but I will stick my neck out
here.
You are not actually saying "click on the green button to continue" so, if
you use css for formatting,
it should remove the problem and Bobby should be OK with it. (too many
shoulds)

If an image conveys important information beyond what is in its
alternative
text,
provide an extended description. (6 instances) Lines 16, 25, 51, 56, 64,
68

Some of the above are not even images.

If a table has two or more rows or columns that serve as headers, use
structural
markup to identify their hierarchy and relationship. (1 instance) Line 12

N/A

Please note that N/A is short for "not applicable in my very humble
opinion".

This should validate for Section 508 which should be OK for now. Next
step - WAI WCAG AAA

If you want to hang on for a day or two I can send you my interpretation
of
the page, using css, for you have a look at.
( then we get the experts to add the finishing touches)

Off to see the Osteopath now. Pay a guy £50 an hour to beat me up.

CUL

Terry

"D. Shane Fowlkes" <shanefowlkes (AT) h-o-t-m-a-i-l (DOT) com> wrote

LANE!

You've got to be kidding. Small world! Remember me?

Hey, Shane!! Small world, indeed! Look for response to your email soon.

Lane

Follow-up:

Terry,

I finally figured out (I think!) how to implement Darrel's suggestion to use
CSS to set color (Thanks Darrel!)...not only for the text in red, but also
for the quotes used throuhgout the site. It seems to have solved many of the
errors that Bobby reported. This should make it a bit simpler. Still not
sure what to do about the other errors.

Again, thanks for taking time to evaluate the site.

www.laneonbass.com

How'd the appointment go?

Lane

"Lane Baldwin" <lane (AT) NOlanebaldwinSPAM (DOT) com> wrote

Follow-up:

Terry,

I finally figured out (I think!) how to implement Darrel's suggestion to
use
CSS to set color (Thanks Darrel!)...not only for the text in red, but also
for the quotes used throuhgout the site. It seems to have solved many of
the
errors that Bobby reported. This should make it a bit simpler. Still not
sure what to do about the other errors.

Again, thanks for taking time to evaluate the site.

www.laneonbass.com

How'd the appointment go?

Lane

Hi Lane,

I just got back. You feel like you have been hit by a truck for a couple of
days afterwards. It works though and the treatment works quicker than
ordinary physiotherapy.

The physios seem to be a lot more gentle but the treatment takes longer and
sometimes wears off sooner. The main advantage with physiotherapy is that I
don't have to pay for it. Anyway, I'm getting O.T. here.

Glad to see you are getting your head round it and still enjoying it :-)

Almost forgot, don't forget the double quotes.

this <TD vAlign=top align=middle>

should be this <td valign="top" align="middle">

See you in a couple of days.

Terry

"Lane Baldwin" <lane (AT) NOlanebaldwinSPAM (DOT) com> wrote

I just ran one of my websites (www.laneonbass.com) through
http://validator.w3.org/ and got two errors:

Your images need optimising as well. Convert your jpegs to jpgs for a start.
This will reduce the file size without reducing the quality. More on that
later.

BFN

Terry