The ultimate three-column layout and doctypes and IE6

I wrote earlier about Matthew James Taylor's approaches to three-column
equal-height CSS-based layouts. He's got versions where the left and
right columns have fixed-pixel widths, where they have fixed-em widths,
and where they have fixed-percentage widths. Here's the one I thought I
had successfully applied after discovering that it handled IE7 where an
earlier approach of his didn't:

http://matthewjamestaylor.com/blog/ultimate-3-column-holy-grail-ems.htm

Here it is again, on my website:

http://www.gavelcade.com/tests/ultimate-strict-xhtml.html

He's got it set up as XHTML 1.0 strict, and it looks good in IE6, IE7,
and Firefox 3. But the site I'm designing is intended to be HTML 4.01
strict. Well, if I change the doctype on Taylor's design to 4.01 strict
(and make the related changes to the HTML) it still looks great in IE7
and Firefox 3, but it dies in IE6. See

http://www.gavelcade.com/tests/ultimate-strict-401.html

Since the pages are being served as text/html, IE6 should be operating
in quirks mode when it receives the page that's configured as XHTML,
correct? It seems odd to me that the "better" browsers would render the
page the same way under either doctype, while appearing correctly in IE6
when in quirks mode and incorrectly in IE6 when in 4.01 strict standards
mode.

Can anyone help me figure this out and possibly figure out how to make
this work in IE6 as 4.01 strict without causing damage in the other
browsers?

On Tue, 03 Feb 2009 12:43:48 -0500
Harlan Messinger <hmessinger.removethis (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote in:
<6ure2lFh0fhjU1 (AT) mid (DOT) individual.net>

[snip]

http://www.gavelcade.com/tests/ultimate-strict-401.html

Since the pages are being served as text/html, IE6 should be operating
in quirks mode when it receives the page that's configured as XHTML,
correct? It seems odd to me that the "better" browsers would render the
page the same way under either doctype, while appearing correctly in IE6
when in quirks mode and incorrectly in IE6 when in 4.01 strict standards
mode.

Can anyone help me figure this out and possibly figure out how to make
this work in IE6 as 4.01 strict without causing damage in the other
browsers?

IE Windows special: the xml prolog

http://www.quirksmode.org/css/quirksmode.html

In IE 6 Windows, Microsoft implemented one extra rule: if a
doctype that triggers strict mode is preceded by an xml
prolog, the page shows in quirks mode.

For IE 6 placing a non-breaking space or perhaps an HTML comment before
the doctype will trigger quirks mode.


--

BootNic Tue Feb 3, 2009 03:34 pm
Complaining is good for you as long as you're not complaining to the
person you're complaining about.
*Lynn Johnston*

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In article <6ure2lFh0fhjU1 (AT) mid (DOT) individual.net>,
Harlan Messinger <hmessinger.removethis (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

....

http://www.gavelcade.com/tests/ultimate-strict-xhtml.html

He's got it set up as XHTML 1.0 strict, and it looks good in IE6, IE7,
and Firefox 3. But the site I'm designing is intended to be HTML 4.01
strict. Well, if I change the doctype on Taylor's design to 4.01 strict
(and make the related changes to the HTML) it still looks great in IE7

Not on my IE7?

--
dorayme

dorayme wrote:

In article <6ure2lFh0fhjU1 (AT) mid (DOT) individual.net>,
Harlan Messinger <hmessinger.removethis (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

...
http://www.gavelcade.com/tests/ultimate-strict-xhtml.html

He's got it set up as XHTML 1.0 strict, and it looks good in IE6, IE7,
and Firefox 3. But the site I'm designing is intended to be HTML 4.01
strict. Well, if I change the doctype on Taylor's design to 4.01 strict
(and make the related changes to the HTML) it still looks great in IE7

Not on my IE7?

Nor on my IE6?

--
Gus

Gus Richter wrote:

dorayme wrote:
In article <6ure2lFh0fhjU1 (AT) mid (DOT) individual.net>,
Harlan Messinger <hmessinger.removethis (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

...
http://www.gavelcade.com/tests/ultimate-strict-xhtml.html

He's got it set up as XHTML 1.0 strict, and it looks good in IE6,
IE7, and Firefox 3. But the site I'm designing is intended to be HTML
4.01 strict. Well, if I change the doctype on Taylor's design to 4.01
strict (and make the related changes to the HTML) it still looks
great in IE7

Not on my IE7?


Nor on my IE6?

The XHTML version doesn't look good in IE6 and IE7 on your respective
machines?

Harlan Messinger wrote:

Gus Richter wrote:
dorayme wrote:
In article <6ure2lFh0fhjU1 (AT) mid (DOT) individual.net>,
Harlan Messinger <hmessinger.removethis (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

...
http://www.gavelcade.com/tests/ultimate-strict-xhtml.html

He's got it set up as XHTML 1.0 strict, and it looks good in IE6,
IE7, and Firefox 3. But the site I'm designing is intended to be
HTML 4.01 strict. Well, if I change the doctype on Taylor's design
to 4.01 strict (and make the related changes to the HTML) it still
looks great in IE7

Not on my IE7?


Nor on my IE6?


The XHTML version doesn't look good in IE6 and IE7 on your respective
machines?

Regarding the above link:
Actually, I took dorayme at her word that it did not render well on IE7.
When I posted, it definitely did not render well on IE6, on this machine.
For you, I've now gone to my IE7 machine and it renders well there.
I've gone back again to my IE6 machine and it *now* also renders well.
I have to conclude that you're altering the page and that I'm no longer
looking at the original one, so I'm out of here ......

--
Gus

Harlan Messinger wrote:

I wrote earlier about Matthew James Taylor's approaches to three-column
equal-height CSS-based layouts. He's got versions where the left and
right columns have fixed-pixel widths, where they have fixed-em widths,
and where they have fixed-percentage widths. Here's the one I thought I
had successfully applied after discovering that it handled IE7 where an
earlier approach of his didn't:

http://matthewjamestaylor.com/blog/ultimate-3-column-holy-grail-ems.htm

Here it is again, on my website:

http://www.gavelcade.com/tests/ultimate-strict-xhtml.html

Just a brief note on checking this in different environments/ua's.

There is browsershots.org.

I know of that because some kind soul turned me on to it when I was
testing my equal column height code. It's not a bad plan to run such
stuff, which can break badly and unknowingly in some environments
through that.

Jeff

In article <gmgdlm$932$1 (AT) news (DOT) motzarella.org>,
Gus Richter <gusrichter (AT) netscape (DOT) net> wrote:

dorayme wrote:
In article <6ure2lFh0fhjU1 (AT) mid (DOT) individual.net>,
Harlan Messinger <hmessinger.removethis (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

...
http://www.gavelcade.com/tests/ultimate-strict-xhtml.html

He's got it set up as XHTML 1.0 strict, and it looks good in IE6, IE7,
and Firefox 3. But the site I'm designing is intended to be HTML 4.01
strict. Well, if I change the doctype on Taylor's design to 4.01 strict
(and make the related changes to the HTML) it still looks great in IE7

Not on my IE7?


Nor on my IE6?

Well, IE6 was the point of OP's post. I was surprised by IE7 though.

--
dorayme

In article <6v2ubvFi4hhgU2 (AT) mid (DOT) individual.net>,
Harlan Messinger <hmessinger.removethis (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

Gus Richter wrote:
dorayme wrote:
In article <6ure2lFh0fhjU1 (AT) mid (DOT) individual.net>,
Harlan Messinger <hmessinger.removethis (AT) comcast (DOT) net> wrote:

...
http://www.gavelcade.com/tests/ultimate-strict-xhtml.html

He's got it set up as XHTML 1.0 strict, and it looks good in IE6,
IE7, and Firefox 3. But the site I'm designing is intended to be HTML
4.01 strict. Well, if I change the doctype on Taylor's design to 4.01
strict (and make the related changes to the HTML) it still looks
great in IE7

Not on my IE7?


Nor on my IE6?


The XHTML version doesn't look good in IE6 and IE7 on your respective
machines?

No problem about these on my XP box. I was referring to your 4.01
version and you seeming to imply that it was a prob on 6 but not 7. My
remark, "Not on my IE7?" was just subsequent to your words: "...But the
site I'm designing is intended to be HTML 4.01 strict. Well, if I change
the doctype on Taylor's design to 4.01 strict (and make the related
changes to the HTML) it still looks great in IE7"

I see I should have quoted better and included:

http://www.gavelcade.com/tests/ultimate-strict-401.html

(Sorry Gus and you if this was not obvious, I simply assumed that
everyone knew the strength of the Matthew James Taylor design was that
it *did* work in IE7 and 6 as well as all other modern browsers - more
or less...)

--
dorayme