Re: How to define a HTML page not allow scroll bars and resize?

PTM wrote:

That's not always true. Often users get frustrated or annoyed by windows
that are far too big or small for the content. Sometimes it's preferable
(user wise) for the window size to be dictated by the developer.

What about windows that are forced by the developer to be too small for
the content, and in which resizing and scrollbars have been disabled,
so that there's no way to see all of the content? I've run into that
sort of atrocity all too often. Developers who perpretrate these
crimes against humanity should be executed by firing squad.

--
Dan

"Dan" <dan (AT) tobias (DOT) name> wrote

PTM wrote:
That's not always true. Often users get frustrated or annoyed by windows
that are far too big or small for the content. Sometimes it's preferable
(user wise) for the window size to be dictated by the developer.

What about windows that are forced by the developer to be too small for
the content, and in which resizing and scrollbars have been disabled,
so that there's no way to see all of the content? I've run into that
sort of atrocity all too often. Developers who perpretrate these
crimes against humanity should be executed by firing squad.

--
Dan

That's exactly what I just said.

users get frustrated or annoyed by windows
that are far too big or small for the content. Sometimes it's preferable
(user wise) for the window size to be dictated by the developer

I've seen users who ARE allowed to do anything they want with
windows/dialogs/etc, minimize errors boxes that MUST have an option selected
before they continue. And also those who reduce the size so small they can't
see the actual window because of so much other clutter the have open. Then
they wonder why things aren't working.

Please note I did say "sometimes it's preferable", users CAN be stupid,
nothing can be idiot proof, but reducing the problems they can potentially
cause themselves, through good interface design, is often preferable to
personal (user) preference.

The original question was about html/css NOT the rights or wrongs of
interface design. Perhaps the guy who asked it is one of those who likes to
do it right and put the right content into the right place at the right time
to get the right results. Perhaps we should also consider starting an
Interface Design newsgroup so everyone who has had to put up with shoddy
developers can bitch about it to their hearts content :-)

Phil

PTM wrote:

I've seen users who ARE allowed to do anything they want with
windows/dialogs/etc, minimize errors boxes that MUST have an option
selected before they continue.

Wrong use of eror boxes; they shouild only be used for information. You
have described a dialog.

And also those who reduce the size so small they can't see the actual
window because of so much other clutter the have open. Then they
wonder why things aren't working.

You can't prevent users reformatting their hard disks either, luckily.
Sometimes people screw things up, and the only way you can prevent that
is by stopping them doing anything. However this isn't likely to be easy
on the worldwide web.

Please note I did say "sometimes it's preferable", users CAN be
stupid, nothing can be idiot proof, but reducing the problems they
can potentially cause themselves, through good interface design, is
often preferable to personal (user) preference.

However on the worldwide web, the users' preferences override the
authors'. That's just the way it is; it's just like that.

Perhaps you should be arguing that idiots should be prevented from using
the internet; I happen to believe that that position has a lot going for
it. Most others disagree. I also think that computers are still too
difficult for average folks to get to grips with. They should be given
games-consoles, or Web-TVs, instead. Real, programmable computers are
for geeks. Most others seem to disagree.

But it's moot; there's no way of preventing idiots from using the
internet. We all therefore have to account for idiots in the way we
design our services. Too bad for us. That's just the way it is. It's
just like that.

The original question was about html/css NOT the rights or wrongs of
interface design. Perhaps the guy who asked it is one of those who
likes to do it right and put the right content into the right place
at the right time to get the right results. Perhaps we should also
consider starting an Interface Design newsgroup so everyone who has
had to put up with shoddy developers can bitch about it to their
hearts content :-)

I have no doubt that such newsgroups exist, somewhere among the 60,000
or so that my .newsrc is aware of. If they aren't particularly active,
that might be because there isn't a lot that's new to say about the
subject.

Or not.
--
Jack.
http://www.jackpot.uk.net/