Re: form label

On Wed, 25 Aug 2004 13:09:49 -0400, Brian
<usenet3 (AT) julietremblay (DOT) com.invalid> wrote:

I'm wondering what the group thinks is the best way to display the
label> element. The default rendering in Moz and MSIE/Win (probably
others, too) only changes the mouse cursor (that's a strange term) from
text-select to default (an arrow). That, to me, is too subtle, and is a
bit like "mystery meat" navigation. The user must hover the mouse before
they know there was something special.

Yet there are form controls available, so the label not being clearly
identified as having special powers doesn't really reduce functionality
like true mystery meat. Rather, it fails to notify the user that there is
anything special.

Simon Willison suggested changing the cursor to pointer used for links.
I don't like that approache for two reasons: one, it confused links with
labels; and two, it still suffers "mystery meat" syndrome.

I've decided to add underlining to my labels, at least on a trial basis.
The advantage is that it gives the user a clear indication that there's
something different about that text. The danger is that it, too, could
confuse visitors into thinking there's a link.

I don't like either for the same reason.

The only distinguishing characteristic is the color: black for <label>,
and the user's default link color for <a>. But then, there's no real
danger to a user clicking on a label. It will only change focus to the
associated field.

No danger, no, but...

Here's an example:

http://www.bonfete.biz/contact/

Any thoughts?

.... I'm thinking this just feels awkward to me to use. Not the ideal
solution, I think.

Perhaps a dotted under-border, then if the user expects a tooltip you can
add title to tell them this is a label for a form item. Or something along
those lines.

What's hard is the typical user knows links are underlined, so a solid
underline is going to bear similarity to a user experience, for good or
bad. But I can't imagine most people are aware of how form labels work at
any level, and besides browsers don't really do anything special to them
so how would they? Since there's no commonly-known UA behavior to work
from with these, we're inventing whatever usability-friendly method we use
from scratch, which means no pages will do it the same, which means the
users won't ever have a way that they're most used to.

Interesting topic.

On Wed, 25 Aug 2004 15:12:26 -0400, Brian
<usenet3 (AT) julietremblay (DOT) com.invalid> wrote:

Neal wrote:

Perhaps a dotted under-border, then if the user expects a tooltip you
can add title to tell them this is a label for a form item. Or
something along those lines.

Not ideal. What should one put in the title that isn't device specific?
i.e., "click this text to focus on the 'email' input" is awkward, and
far too concerned with the mechanics, which is a bad idea. What if the
user does not use a mouse? Will they understand "focus"? Or "input"?

That's just it - what terminology could you use that would be more
universally applicable AND understood than "Try clicking me "? (Which I
kinda like, except that some users don't click.) As it's a tooltip, it
seems this would be more appropriate a place than any other to put
something dealing with the machanics.

I suppose it's no worse than
before <label> was added. But it pains me, because <label> is one of the
few elements that truly enhances a page and adds usability, especially
for selecting those tiny checkboxes and radio buttons.

All the old Myst players will click anywhere anyway, so they'll find it
fine. It is a shame though. Those buggers are too useful to be left with
no recognizable rendering.

On Wed, 25 Aug 2004 20:56:37 -0400, Brian
<usenet3 (AT) julietremblay (DOT) com.invalid> wrote:

Neal wrote:
All the old Myst players will click anywhere anyway, so they'll find
it fine.

You've lost me. What is "Myst"?

http://www.mismatch.co.uk/myst.htm

It's a classic game, the graphic rendering was considered
state-of-the-art. If you're into thoughtful logic games try it.