IE and Geocities

In article <88e2$48c9a8db$40cba7c6$20887 (AT) NAXS (DOT) COM>,
"Jonathan N. Little" <lws4art (AT) central (DOT) net> wrote:

dorayme wrote:
In article <m1abeeioa2.fsf (AT) dot-app (DOT) org>,
Sherm Pendley <spamtrap (AT) dot-app (DOT) org> wrote:

Fistro <rafaminu (AT) gmail (DOT) com> writes:

On Sep 11, 4:02 pm, Ben Bacarisse <ben.use... (AT) bsb (DOT) me.uk> wrote:
The server is adding elements in front of the DOCTYPE. The DOCTYPE is
designed to put all browsers in "standards" rather than "quirks" mode
but any text at all before it changes this behaviour.
This is the code being added:
It doesn't matter *what* gets added. What part of "any text at all" is
not clear to you?


I regularly add things like

?php $thisPage="name"; ?

But that does not send that text to the browser, as with any
*server-side* code.

I know.

Just trying to take the heat off poor old Fistro. I regard my
intervention as like waving some red rag at some bulls in a ring so a
defenceless human quarry op gets time to jump fence before horrible
bloody goring...

So maybe there is more to understanding "any text at all" than might
seem.

So to more finely define it, any text sent from the server to the
browser before the DOCTYPE will cause problems...

You are a clever little bull ...

To the OP, do you know you can get some pretty good free hosting without
all this nonsense by the hosters that you are experiencing?

--
dorayme

dorayme wrote:

To the OP, do you know you can get some pretty good free hosting without
all this nonsense by the hosters that you are experiencing?

Already gave him the tip. Didn't seem to be too receptive, I guess he'd
rather keep flogging it to see if he can get IE to fall in line.

--
Take care,

Jonathan
-------------------
LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com

On Sep 12, 3:22 am, "Jonathan N. Little" <lws4... (AT) central (DOT) net> wrote:

dorayme wrote:
To the OP, do you know you can get some pretty good free hosting without
all this nonsense by the hosters that you are experiencing?

Already gave him the tip. Didn't seem to be too receptive, I guess he'd
rather keep flogging it to see if he can get IE to fall in line.

I have already made IE fall in line. Still a few things to tune up,
but I got it.

I must apologize to Bacarise for my reaction and thank him and
everyone else for their comments, specially those who provide me with
an insight into the problem.

I know it's not excuse, but I have never encountered this problem
before and I just couldn't believe that on top of all the
inconsistencies that IE has, there was another one that will force me
to start all over again. It is true, I refused to be beaten by some
"quirks mode" imposed upon me by those brainless twits at Microsoft.

Add to that that I have recently replaced my laptop with one running
Vista, and perhaps you can sympathize with my degree of frustration
and amazement at the heights of human stupidity.

But at the end, I have found a workaround and I thank you immensely
for pointing me to the right direction.

I've also found this article very helpful, that explains the way
browsers have been observed to behave when in Quirks Mode:
http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/quirks-mode.html

Cheers

Fistro wrote:

On Sep 12, 3:22 am, "Jonathan N. Little" <lws4... (AT) central (DOT) net> wrote:
dorayme wrote:
To the OP, do you know you can get some pretty good free hosting without
all this nonsense by the hosters that you are experiencing?
Already gave him the tip. Didn't seem to be too receptive, I guess he'd
rather keep flogging it to see if he can get IE to fall in line.

I have already made IE fall in line. Still a few things to tune up,
but I got it.

I must apologize to Bacarise for my reaction and thank him and
everyone else for their comments, specially those who provide me with
an insight into the problem.

I know it's not excuse, but I have never encountered this problem
before and I just couldn't believe that on top of all the
inconsistencies that IE has, there was another one that will force me
to start all over again. It is true, I refused to be beaten by some
"quirks mode" imposed upon me by those brainless twits at Microsoft.

Of course you realize you have compounded your problem by trying to use
XHTML what MSIE has a problem to begin with. IE behaves better, even
when it is in quirks mode, with HTML then when it parses XHTML as tag soup.

Do you have any specific reason for using XHTML other than "because it's
advanced"?


--
Take care,

Jonathan
-------------------
LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com

On Sep 12, 3:34*pm, "Jonathan N. Little" <lws4... (AT) central (DOT) net> wrote:

Fistro wrote:
On Sep 12, 3:22 am, "Jonathan N. Little" <lws4... (AT) central (DOT) net> wrote:
dorayme wrote:
To the OP, do you know you can get some pretty good free hosting without
all this nonsense by the hosters that you are experiencing?
Already gave him the tip. Didn't seem to be too receptive, I guess he'd
rather keep flogging it to see if he can get IE to fall in line.

I have already made IE fall in line. Still a few things to tune up,
but I got it.

I must apologize to Bacarise for my reaction and thank him and
everyone else for their comments, specially those who provide me with
an insight into the problem.

I know it's not excuse, but I have never encountered this problem
before and I just couldn't believe that on top of all the
inconsistencies that IE has, there was another one that will force me
to start all over again. It is true, I refused to be beaten by some
"quirks mode" imposed upon me by those brainless twits at Microsoft.

Of course you realize you have compounded your problem by trying to use
XHTML what MSIE has a problem to begin with. IE behaves better, even
when it is in quirks mode, with HTML then when it parses XHTML as tag soup.

Do you have any specific reason for using XHTML other than "because it's
advanced"?

Nope, no reason.
It just sounds better, HTML sounds so ninetiesh ...

Enough attention devoted to IE, anyway, let them get their act
together, the design renders well in all versions of IE now and that's
what I was trying to do.

As a final thought to this thread I want to point out how the CSS-
related bugs in IE can be so extremely frustrating to the point of
turning a simple project into an unending nightmare.
Please, make the Internet a better place and use Firefox or any other
CSS standards compliant browser.
http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox/?from=sfx&uid=246911&aid=4414569

You can also complain by letter to MS HQ and representatives. Don't
try to email them , it won't work, and you'll get blacklisted.

Thank you

Fistro wrote:

Do you have any specific reason for using XHTML other than "because it's
advanced"?

Nope, no reason.
It just sounds better, HTML sounds so ninetiesh ...

Well, Jukka would be quickly note: 'a mark of cluelessness'

Trying XHTML, (and I mean 'trying' because your attempt is not valid
XHTML) is not helping your situation. Do a little Googling and you will
discover that XHTML does not have a real future at this point and HTML
is far from dead. If you abandoned your attempt at XHTML and used HTML
you will find that IE will cooperate will little effort on your part.

--
Take care,

Jonathan
-------------------
LITTLE WORKS STUDIO
http://www.LittleWorksStudio.com

On Sep 12, 6:54*pm, "Jonathan N. Little" <lws4... (AT) central (DOT) net> wrote:

Fistro wrote:
Do you have any specific reason for using XHTML other than "because it's
advanced"?

Nope, no reason.
It just sounds better, HTML sounds so ninetiesh ...

Well, Jukka would be quickly note: 'a mark of cluelessness'

Trying XHTML, (and I mean 'trying' because your attempt is not valid
XHTML) is not helping your situation. Do a little Googling and you will
discover that XHTML does not have a real future at this point and HTML
is far from dead. If you abandoned your attempt at XHTML and used HTML
you will find that IE will cooperate will little effort on your part.

I'm not going to make anymore changes as of now (well, just one
more ...), but thanks for the lead again, I've read a good article on
XHTML myths here:
http://boulderjams.wordpress.com/2007/08/27/xhtml-myths-and-more/

On 12 Sep, 16:34, "Jonathan N. Little" <lws4... (AT) central (DOT) net> wrote:

Fistro wrote:
On Sep 12, 3:22 am, "Jonathan N. Little" <lws4... (AT) central (DOT) net> wrote:
dorayme wrote:
To the OP, do you know you can get some pretty good free hosting without
all this nonsense by the hosters that you are experiencing?
Already gave him the tip. Didn't seem to be too receptive, I guess he'd
rather keep flogging it to see if he can get IE to fall in line.

I have already made IE fall in line. Still a few things to tune up,
but I got it.

I must apologize to Bacarise for my reaction and thank him and
everyone else for their comments, specially those who provide me with
an insight into the problem.

I know it's not excuse, but I have never encountered this problem
before and I just couldn't believe that on top of all the
inconsistencies that IE has, there was another one that will force me
to start all over again. It is true, I refused to be beaten by some
"quirks mode" imposed upon me by those brainless twits at Microsoft.

Of course you realize you have compounded your problem by trying to use
XHTML what MSIE has a problem to begin with. IE behaves better, even
when it is in quirks mode, with HTML then when it parses XHTML as tag soup.

How does IE behave better when it parsers HTML as a tag soup, instead
of XHTML as an HTML tag soup? I wouldn't be suprised, but do you have
a
reference or something?

I suspect they just search for the word 'html' inside the DOCTYPE
declaration, and then treat XHTML as any other HTML tag soup. Their
own blogg says they are going to 'continue to read XHTML when served
as “text/html”, presuming it follows the HTML compatibility
recommendations'.

http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/archive/2005/09/15/467901.aspx

--
"I made the decision to not try to support the MIME type in IE7 simply
because I personally want XHTML to be successful in the long run."
- Chris Wilson

On Sep 12, 11:17*pm, "Roy A." <royarnes... (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote:

On 12 Sep, 16:34, "Jonathan N. Little" <lws4... (AT) central (DOT) net> wrote:



Fistro wrote:
On Sep 12, 3:22 am, "Jonathan N. Little" <lws4... (AT) central (DOT) net> wrote:
dorayme wrote:
To the OP, do you know you can get some pretty good free hosting without
all this nonsense by the hosters that you are experiencing?
Already gave him the tip. Didn't seem to be too receptive, I guess he'd
rather keep flogging it to see if he can get IE to fall in line.

I have already made IE fall in line. Still a few things to tune up,
but I got it.

I must apologize to Bacarise for my reaction and thank him and
everyone else for their comments, specially those who provide me with
an insight into the problem.

I know it's not excuse, but I have never encountered this problem
before and I just couldn't believe that on top of all the
inconsistencies that IE has, there was another one that will force me
to start all over again. It is true, I refused to be beaten by some
"quirks mode" imposed upon me by those brainless twits at Microsoft.

Of course you realize you have compounded your problem by trying to use
XHTML what MSIE has a problem to begin with. IE behaves better, even
when it is in quirks mode, with HTML then when it parses XHTML as tag soup.

How does IE behave better when it parsers HTML as a tag soup, instead
of XHTML as an HTML tag soup? I wouldn't be suprised, but do you have
a
reference or something?

I suspect they just search for the word 'html' inside the DOCTYPE
declaration, and then treat XHTML as any other HTML tag soup. Their
own blogg says they are going to 'continue to read XHTML when served
as “text/html”, presuming it follows the HTML compatibility
recommendations'.

http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/archive/2005/09/15/467901.aspx

Gosh, just by reading that blog I get sick in the stomach.

Here's an excerpt:

"Hello everyone!

One of the features we improved in IE8 is the ‘new tab’ page, which is
the page you see by default when you click the New Tab button on the
Tab row, or if you hit CTRL+T (the keyboard shortcut that does the
same thing). We’re the Program Managers for this page and would like
to walk you through the history and evolution of this feature to what
it is today in IE8 Beta 2.
When IE7 was released in 2006, many users did not know what tabs were,
so our new tab page didn’t really do anything except say “I’m a tab”
and offer a link to help content for folks who were interested in
learning more. Now it’s 2008, and web users are even more
sophisticated and tab-enabled browsers are ubiquitous, so we decided
that it was time to start making the new tab page more useful than
just saying “I’m here."

How about that, people? one of the "features" they improved in IE8 is
the ‘new tab’ page ... Are these people working hard or what?
But no plans for supporting the “application/xml+xhtml” MIME type in
IE7 simply because they want XHTML to be successful.
I think I gonna throw up ...