God I miss tables-help needed!

Hi again,
Ok so I've got two new problems with this layout
http://www.paulwatt.info/test/turn/

1) When I increase the width of the Maincontent Div from 73% to 74% to line
it up with the right hand side of the page, the whole div drops to below the
level of the leftcell div. put it back to 73% and it goes back to its
correct posistion.

2) It looks fine in IE but a absolute dogs dinner in FF. whys this?

Thanks once again for all your help! This would be soooooo easy to do with
the good old <table> tag!

Paul

http://www.paulwatt.info

And lo, Paul Watt didst speak in
alt.html,alt.http://www.webmaster,comp.infosystem...style sheets:

Hi again,
Ok so I've got two new problems with this layout
http://www.paulwatt.info/test/turn/

1) When I increase the width of the Maincontent Div from 73% to 74% to
line
it up with the right hand side of the page, the whole div drops to below
the
level of the leftcell div. put it back to 73% and it goes back to its
correct posistion.

2) It looks fine in IE but a absolute dogs dinner in FF. whys this?

Thanks once again for all your help! This would be soooooo easy to do
with the good old <table> tag!

Paul, you are taking the table-layout mode of thought and trying to force
it upon CSS and expecting it to comply. These blocks are still "cells" to
you, which is likely why you feel the need to over-specify properties on
them. Relax, and remember that the more CSS you have, the harder it is to
debug. Keep things simple, the default styles on the block elements you
are using already provide for most of what you are trying to do.

First, remove the width property from the .maincontent rule entirely.
<div>'s expand to fit all available horizontal space by default, so the
margin-left property is the only width-limiting style you require here.

To change how far the .maincontent div sits apart from the menu, just
change the value of the margin-left property. That's it.

Grey

--
The technical axiom that nothing is impossible sinisterly implies the
pitfall corollary that nothing is ridiculous.
- http://www.greywyvern.com/orca#search - Orca Search: Full-featured
spider and site-search engine

Grey,

Am I correct in inferring from this thread that tables are being
superceded by divs for layout. Could you point me to some website(s)
that discuss this evolution?

Many thanks,
Richard

"Richard" <RichardDummyMailbox58407 (AT) USComputerGurus (DOT) com> wrote in
news:1144189582.184966.324480 (AT) e56g2000cwe (DOT) googlegroups.com:

Grey,

Am I correct in inferring from this thread that tables are being
superceded by divs for layout. Could you point me to some website(s)
that discuss this evolution?

http://w3.org



--
Karl Groves
http://karlcore.com
http://chevelle.karlcore.com

Accessibility Discussion List: http://smallerurl.com/?id=6p764du

Richard wrote:

Grey,

Am I correct in inferring from this thread that tables are being
superceded by divs for layout. Could you point me to some website(s)
that discuss this evolution?

Many thanks,
Richard

Not so much replaced as divs as replaced by semantic markup with
presentation controlled with CSS.

A good place to start:
http://www.hotdesign.com/seybold/

Others:
http://alistapart.com/
http://benmeadowcroft.com/webdev/
http://csszengarden.com/
http://glish.com/css/
http://internalysis.com/css.html
http://mezzoblue.com/archives/css/
http://porjes.com/example_css.html
http://positioniseverything.net/
http://thenoodleincident.com/tutorials/css/index.html
http://tjkdesign.com/articles/
http://tobyinkster.co.uk/web
http://www.fu2k.org/alex/css/
http://www.spartanicus.utvinternet.ie/index.htm

Richard wrote:

Grey,

Am I correct in inferring from this thread that tables are being
superceded by divs for layout. Could you point me to some website(s)
that discuss this evolution?

I don't mean to sound rude, but you are WAY behind the times on this.

Study up on CSS - that will give you at least a basis to start from. The
tutorial at w3schools is a decent start.

Hi Karl,

http://w3.org

Good point. I found a good "con" article there. I'll look at the site
further.

Thanks for you guidance. I guess I could have thought of that myself,
but I wanted to see the best places to look.

Regards,
Richard

Hi Nik,

Not so much replaced as divs as replaced by semantic markup with
presentation controlled with CSS.

At first glance, it sounds like a good idea.

A good place to start:
http://www.hotdesign.com/seybold/

That was a good place to start! I get the idea now and follow their
guidelines to see how it turns out on stuff I'm working on now.

Others:

Thanks for the list. I'll take a look at them from time to time.

Regards,
Richard

Tony wrote:

Richard wrote:

Grey,

Am I correct in inferring from this thread that tables are being
superceded by divs for layout. Could you point me to some website(s)
that discuss this evolution?


I don't mean to sound rude, but you are WAY behind the times on this.

Study up on CSS - that will give you at least a basis to start from. The
tutorial at w3schools is a decent start.

I think you and many others are confusing content and markup.
If the data to be displayed is tabular, I'd choose tables over div,
simply coz' I want the page to be legible unstyled as well.
I never read the table tag is being deprecated or obsolete. But then
again, there's so many things I haven't read yet.

I'd advise to start a page design by properly choosing the right html
tags for the page elements. Then use CSS to make a nice(r) layout.
Add divs where needed, but at all cost avoid the omnipresent div soup.
Some folks just replaced all their former tag soup for a different soup
flavour.

If your page looks like faeces when viewed unstyled, there's a good
chance you have started the wrong way. And I am willing to admit I
created enough examples of 'the wrong way' myself.

Did I grasp correctly this is the point Richard was trying to make?

Sh.

Hi Tony,

I don't mean to sound rude, but you are WAY behind the times on this.

You got that right! :-) I'm just starting to put up a technical
presentation on a web server, so I'm interested in applying the best
techniques while ensuring I get the job done in a timely fashion. So
I've employed some CSS stuff, some Table stuff, some site navigation.
And I've trolled Google Groups once in while to get current ideas about
this stuff. The idea in this thread, crudely stated, seemed to be
Tables:bad, CSS:good. I wanted to get some sense of this now, long
before I become a CSS guru. Hence my question, which elicited some
good ideas that I'll start applying pronto.

So, no offense taken ... because I surely am "WAY behind the times on
this".

Regards,
Richard