CSS Localization

shapper wrote:

--
Yucca,http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

A fullquote down to the sig - always a useful signal of cluelessness.

What do you (participants in this group) think a good approach for
localization would be?

You're not telling what you are localizing and in what sense or why you
think CSS is relevant.

If you have no clue of what you are doing, it's wrong to start from CSS.
It's just optional presentational suggestings. Painting of a building, so to
say. Would you paint a building before having built it?

I got two interesting options:
1. Body > I think this method is often used to give a different style
to the menu "button" of current page;
2. Have a separated CSS file that contains the localized styles. Seems
a good way ...

Your "options" make no sense, especially in the absence of any relevant
context.

I think my question was simple, clear, fair and had some points ...

In reality, your question lacked all of those properties, and you are not
making things any better now.

--
Yucca, http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

On Mar 23, 5:41*pm, "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorp... (AT) cs (DOT) tut.fi> wrote:

shapper wrote:
--
Yucca,http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

A fullquote down to the sig - always a useful signal of cluelessness.

What do you (participants in this group) think a good approach for
localization would be?

You're not telling what you are localizing and in what sense or why you
think CSS is relevant.

If you have no clue of what you are doing, it's wrong to start from CSS.
It's just optional presentational suggestings. Painting of a building, soto
say. Would you paint a building before having built it?

I got two interesting options:
1. Body > I think this method is often used to give a different style
to the menu "button" of current page;
2. Have a separated CSS file that contains the localized styles. Seems
a good way ...

Your "options" make no sense, especially in the absence of any relevant
context.

I think my question was simple, clear, fair and had some points ...

In reality, your question lacked all of those properties, and you are not
making things any better now.

--
Yucca,http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

Yucca,

I did mentioned the situations. A real problem that I am using now:

A background image used in a CSS style.
The image contains text. This text must be localized so the image
must be localized.

How can this not be a real problem?

And how can I describe it better than this? I think it is completely
clear ...


b) A menu using images ... seems a real situation to, right?

shapper wrote:

On Mar 21, 10:57 am, "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorp... (AT) cs (DOT) tut.fi> wrote:
Harlan Messinger wrote:
Jukka K. Korpela wrote:
shapper wrote:
I know that CSS is not the primary tool for localization.
It's nothing of the kind. Your statement is like saying "I know that
a hammer is not the primary tool for curing cancer".
Everything presented to a user that should vary by locale,
That's an absurd idea. There is more than enough to be done with things that
need to be localized, so it's absurd to say that everything should be
localized. Besides, we don't know the user's locale; there is no way to
access it in HTML or in CSS. A locale is much more than just the language,
so it's better to speak of translations when you mean just translations.

No one said anything about using
CSS as a "tool for localization", primary or otherwise.
Read what you quoted. Let me help you there... "CSS is not the primary tool
for localization". This implies the idea that CSS is a tool for
localization.

You've gone off on a tangent,
It may look that way to you, but what's a tangent in your eyes might be the
main line of thought to someone else, and your curves are just distractions.

about the issues involved in relying on
CSS for the UI.
That's very much an issue that belongs to the topic of this group.
Localization mostly doesn't, unless it has something real to do with CSS.
For example, if a page exists in different languages, it is relevant to ask
whether one can still use the same style sheet. (The correct answer to that
is fairly complex.)

--
Yucca,http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

Yucca,

1. I do localization on my server side code (C#) and on my SQL Server
database;
And I do it heavily ... I have web applications with more than 10
cultures.
Localization includes many issues and I am aware of them all ...

2. I can see, as I mentioned, situations where CSS can "insert" into a
page an element that could need localization.
a) A background image with some text ... seems a real situation or
not?
b) A menu using images ... seems a real situation to, right?

Even if it is not a localization tool ...

My questions is:

What do you (participants in this group) think a good approach for
localization would be?

I got two interesting options:
1. Body > I think this method is often used to give a different style
to the menu "button" of current page;
2. Have a separated CSS file that contains the localized styles. Seems
a good way ...

Yucca,

I think my question was simple, clear, fair and had some points ...

You just go completely off for no reasonable reason I can see ...

I think I am going for option 2.

Since I mentioned method 1, but now know more about your needs, I'd go
with option 2 also. There's lot's of ways to implement that including
..htaccess redirects. I suspect these pages are already server driven and
writing a different link href would be easiest.

Jeff

Thanks,
Miguel

On Mar 23, 11:37*pm, Jeff <jeff_th... (AT) att (DOT) net> wrote:

shapper wrote:
On Mar 21, 10:57 am, "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorp... (AT) cs (DOT) tut.fi> wrote:
Harlan Messinger wrote:
Jukka K. Korpela wrote:
shapper wrote:
I know that CSS is not the primary tool for localization.
It's nothing of the kind. Your statement is like saying "I know that
a hammer is not the primary tool for curing cancer".
Everything presented to a user that should vary by locale,
That's an absurd idea. There is more than enough to be done with things that
need to be localized, so it's absurd to say that everything should be
localized. Besides, we don't know the user's locale; there is no way to
access it in HTML or in CSS. A locale is much more than just the language,
so it's better to speak of translations when you mean just translations.

No one said anything about using
CSS as a "tool for localization", primary or otherwise.
Read what you quoted. Let me help you there... "CSS is not the primarytool
for localization". This implies the idea that CSS is a tool for
localization.

You've gone off on a tangent,
It may look that way to you, but what's a tangent in your eyes might be the
main line of thought to someone else, and your curves are just distractions.

about the issues involved in relying on
CSS for the UI.
That's very much an issue that belongs to the topic of this group.
Localization mostly doesn't, unless it has something real to do with CSS.
For example, if a page exists in different languages, it is relevant to ask
whether one can still use the same style sheet. (The correct answer tothat
is fairly complex.)

--
Yucca,http://www.cs.tut.fi/~jkorpela/

Yucca,

1. I do localization on my server side code (C#) and on my SQL Server
database;
* * And I do it heavily ... I have web applications with more than 10
cultures.
* * Localization includes many issues and I am aware of them all ....

2. I can see, as I mentioned, situations where CSS can "insert" into a
page an element that could need localization.
* * a) A background image with some text ... seems a real situationor
not?
* * b) A menu using images ... seems a real situation to, right?

Even if it is not a localization tool ...

My questions is:

What do you (participants in this group) think a good approach for
localization would be?

I got two interesting options:
1. Body > I think this method is often used to give a different style
to the menu "button" of current page;
2. Have a separated CSS file that contains the localized styles. Seems
a good way ...

Yucca,

I think my question was simple, clear, fair and had some points ...

You just go completely off for no reasonable reason I can see ...

I think I am going for option 2.

Since I mentioned method 1, but now know more about your needs, I'd go
with option 2 also. There's lot's of ways to implement that including
.htaccess redirects. I suspect these pages are already server driven and
writing a different link href would be easiest.

* * Jeff



Thanks,
Miguel

Yes,

The approach I am using is having the following folder structure:
Folder CSS
- Reset.css
- Common.css
- Folder EN-GB
Localized.css
- Folder FR-FR
Localized.css
- Folder PT-PT
Localized.css

Then on server side I load Reset.css, Common.css and Localized.css for
current culture.

Well, basically something around this.

Thanks,
Miguel