gap rendered in Firefox 3 but not in IE 7

GTalbot wrote:

It does not work for me and for cases involving adjoining margin
collapsing.

Then don't use it. Simple. It works for me every time.

Resetting margins to 0 and collapsing margins is *not* the
same thing.

You obviously don't understand Collapsing Margins.
If there are no margins, then there are none to collapse.
If the problematic gap goes away, it's due to margins.
If there is no intentional idiotic margin manipulation, then it's due to
Collapsing Margins.

Gérard

Please use a signature delimiter. See my sig. as an example.

~~~~~~~~~~~

For God's sake man! I know, I knew and I concede (if you want) that IE
has a conforming problem (surprise)! It was understood and I even said
so! This has nothing to do with the reason for Firefox's gap rendering
(in the original - problem is now fixed)! The page was rendered
correctly by Firefox per the specifications re. Collapsing Margins! The
OP asked why this was so. I told him that it was due to Collapsing
Margins. Why do you harp on IE being the one rendering incorrectly?
Everyone knows this!

The second weird thing that you're on about is regarding my tip to be
able to quickly determine if there is a Collapsing Margin problem. I am
fairly familiar with Collapsing Margins and went to look at the source
of the page first and noted that it was convoluted (to be kind). Anyway,
I thought that it was a can of worms to wade through (not being a
reduced test case) and quickly used the diagnostic/tip method via
Firefox's Web Developer add-on and lo and behold, the gap went away. It
confirmed my suspicion. What's so terrible about that!? Oh yes, the fact
that it overcompensates and messes up other areas. Bah, you don't
understand or read well when I said that it is "temporary" and "who
cares about the other areas during this temporary period". You don't
like the Tool, then don't use it, simple, but don't come on about it
being evil. What a bunch of malarkey.

Once one knows the reason, the cure should be simple. The specifications
clearly point out methods to stop margins from collapsing.
Neredbeaujingles provided one for this instance. Since he apparently
also does not use/like the Tip and since his response was "Try ....." he
seems to prefer to guess and use a shotgun approach. You apparently as well.

I have encountered some weird things and weird people on the newsgroups
and I must say that this encounter ranks up there! I've been kind. You
should see my other two drafts!

At least dorayme understands this simple thing (thank you), so there are
sane people here after all.

--
Gus

On 15 Jun 2008, dorayme <doraymeRidThis (AT) optusnet (DOT) com.au> wrote:

If a 2 sec zeroing of the margins makes the unwanted phenomena
disappear, you know it might well be a margin problem and you can
look more locally then. So your contribution makes no reasoned
sense to me.

Not really. If one element has unwanted/inadvertant/mistaken padding
and the adjacent element has a wanted default margin, you've just
"identified" the wrong problem thru carelessness.

What has this got to do with using say * {margin: 0} for less than 2
seconds (in which time you do *not* try to identify anything
positively or "fix" anything or run into any dangers whatsoever. You
just look to see if some unwanted look is affected for the better. If
you think it is a waste of time, make sure you never do it, not even
to waste 2 sec. Others will use it and it will often be worth the 2
secs.

Well, I never have used it, and even though it's only 2 seconds, 2 seconds
wasted here and 2 seconds wasted there...

To see this point, you need to understand the spirit in which it is
used and not jump to too many conclusions.

The spirit may be euphoric, but the logic is irrational. However, if it
helps you (and some others) to a better web page, don't let me wee-wee on
your fire. Most things aren't built entirely on correctness and erudition.

--
Neredbojias
http://www.neredbojias.net/
Great sights and sounds

In article <Xns9ABE98CB48F77neredbojiasnano (AT) 85 (DOT) 214.90.236>,
Neredbojias <me@http://www.neredbojias.net/_eml/fliam.php> wrote:

On 15 Jun 2008, dorayme <doraymeRidThis (AT) optusnet (DOT) com.au> wrote:

If a 2 sec zeroing of the margins makes the unwanted phenomena
disappear, you know it might well be a margin problem and you can
look more locally then. So your contribution makes no reasoned
sense to me.

Not really. If one element has unwanted/inadvertant/mistaken padding
and the adjacent element has a wanted default margin, you've just
"identified" the wrong problem thru carelessness.

What has this got to do with using say * {margin: 0} for less than 2
seconds (in which time you do *not* try to identify anything
positively or "fix" anything or run into any dangers whatsoever. You
just look to see if some unwanted look is affected for the better.

Well, I never have used it, and even though it's only 2 seconds, 2 seconds
wasted here and 2 seconds wasted there...

You are right not to use a technique that you do not understand in the
slightest way.

--
dorayme

On 15 Jun 2008, dorayme <doraymeRidThis (AT) optusnet (DOT) com.au> wrote:

What has this got to do with using say * {margin: 0} for less than
2 seconds (in which time you do *not* try to identify anything
positively or "fix" anything or run into any dangers whatsoever.
You just look to see if some unwanted look is affected for the
better.

Well, I never have used it, and even though it's only 2 seconds, 2
seconds wasted here and 2 seconds wasted there...

You are right not to use a technique that you do not understand in the
slightest way.

Well, at least we are at last in some sort of agreement. Hallelujah.

--
Neredbojias
http://www.neredbojias.net/
Great sights and sounds